Sojourner at 2011-08-26 06:17:16:
He's headstrong and determined; he's going to push through and not be deterred.

And he's salty.
Annika W at 2011-08-26 09:02:08:
The guy thinks he's one step ahead of the woman in the joke, but she's always the one who knows what's up. In this respect, the joke is Chinatown.
Tavis at 2011-08-26 09:33:13:
"...and also, Dude, Chinaman is not the preferred nomenclature -- Asian-American. Please."
Sojourner at 2011-08-26 13:01:25:
Excellent, Annika.
Scott at 2011-08-26 13:51:24:
@Annika: Per your interpretation, that means the joke serves as a setup to the last line in the movie, doesn't it? This is one of those analyses of a movie moment where you wonder: Did Towne and Polanski actually consciously know they were setting that up or is it just one of those creative coincidences?

It's like that line in Shawshank where Red tells Andy in their last conversation -- about Andy's fantasy of going to Mexico -- "That's just a shitty pipedream." And of course Andy escapes through a shitty pipe. Conscious act on the part of Darabont or creative coincidence?
Annika W at 2011-08-26 15:16:10:
Conscious. Totally. There are thousands of other jokes they could have picked if they simply wanted to show Jake's sense of humor or provide a beat or whatever. But this is the ONE they picked.
John at 2011-08-26 15:37:16:
Every. Single. Bit of Chinatown is deliberate.

Curly, the first client, is an albacore fisherman. The club featured prominently in the script is the Albacore Club.

(You can go dizzy with all the water references.)

Minute 28, the gardener says "Bad for grass" but Gittes mishears: "Bad for 'glass.'" The gardener means salt water (which is the eventual key to the mystery -- salt water). But Gittes also finds the KEY TO THE MYSTERY right then and there -- the *broken eyeglasses* in the water. He's interrupted by Evelyn.

Structure? You want structure? When does Gittes first meet Noah Cross? Smack dab at the one hour mark.

Watch how Gittes's "usual fee" keeps increasing as the movie goes on and as his potential clients get more wealthy.

Also listen for how often Noah Cross refers to "my daughter" and Gittes thinks he means Evelyn when he actually means Katherine.

Also check out Gittes's "death" at minute 72 which follows an extensive "dark night of the soul" which all takes place at night, ending with Gittes following Evelyn to ... Katherine, where the third act begins - exactly at the 90 minute mark.

When Gittes mentions Noah Cross to Evelyn while they're in bed, she covers herself.

While Gittes and Evelyn are talking in the car outside Katherine's, she leans her head against the steering wheel and it honks. It's a moment of humanity, of levity, but it's also a foreshadowing of how Evelyn dies at the end. It tells us what the horn in her car sounds like, so when we hear it again, we know what it is.

The script was originally called WATER AND POWER, which sounds like the perfect title until you hear with CHINATOWN.
Scott at 2011-08-26 15:46:48:
@Annika and John: Sounds like with the upcoming GITS Script Reading and Analysis series, we should do one 'classic' script every six weeks or so. Chinatown would be a great way to kick that off in October. Scripts like that which offer so much depth and attention to detail are not only an example of how to do it right, but also an inspiration.

Thanks, John, for listing those observations. There are plenty more. It really is an amazing script.
David Eng at 2011-08-26 20:49:39:
I love everything about this movie EXCEPT that "joke." As an Asian, I can't help but find it deeply offensive. Robert Towne seems to have a thing for anti-Chinese humor as well (e.g. in Personal Best). Those jokes would be unacceptable for Blacks, Jews or any others. Yet Hollywood thinks it's okay to ignore Asians or treat them with contempt.
Sojourner at 2011-08-27 08:05:00:
One word: context
David Eng at 2011-08-27 11:28:45:
You want context? Watch the documentary "Hollywood Chinese." Asians have been ignored or misrepresented in broad stereotypes (often by white actors) for decades. Anti-Asian racism persists in Hollywood, such as in Hangover 2 or the whitewashing of Last Airbender.

As I said, you would not be able to teach, say, Merchant of Venice or Huckleberry Finn without pointing out that there is racism and by the way these beliefs are no longer acceptable. Yet I'm disappointed that the casual racism in Chinatown went unremarked in this discussion, as if it were still acceptable or agreeable.

You want to improve your writing 100%? Stop seeing everything through the eyes of white men!
Scott at 2011-08-27 12:01:28:
@David: Speaking as a Caucasian, I don't have much in the way of authority on the subject. But let me ask you because I'm genuinely curious, if you had been in Towne's shoes writing the script for Chinatown, how would you have approached writing the joke? Or would you have simply left it out?

My guess is Towne's response to criticism on this front would be that the joke reflects attitudes present with that character and those people in that time and culture, plus as noted in folks' analyses, it has a narrative tie-in to the ending of the story. Since story trumps all, that would likely be his defense.

Interestingly I was at a session yesterday with John Altschuler, who was a writer and shower runner on the animated TV series "King of the Hill" for many years, and that was a show that made fun of middle-class white people. Now working on the reboot of "Beavis & Butt-head" and "The Adam Carolla Show," Altschluer complained about how difficult it is to make fun of ANYONE due to network restrictions. Basically all they want you to do is make sex jokes. For some reason, that's okay.

He noted -- correctly -- shows from the 70s like "All in the Family" and "Maude" which dealt head-on with issues like racism through their humor. But no more in Hollywood, where there is an air of political correctness, at least per Altschuler, that squashes that type of comedy.
David Eng at 2011-08-27 13:56:03:
Well, if I wrote Chinatown I would have had some significant Chinese character(s), not just the servants -- it is after all called Chinatown. I would not have included that joke. But if it was absolutely essential, then I would have tried to show some sensitivity - e.g. put the joke in someone else's lips, not the protagonist (could you imagine a Jewish joke from Oskar Schindler?), or have him come to recognize his racism rather than just be embarrassed because a woman heard him talk dirty.

I understand the resistance to political correctness, but it's more realistic and plain decent to have positive, non-stereotypical portrayals of minorities. The reason why 70s shows like All in the Family were able to include racial humor was because it properly dealt with it rather than just leaving it hanging as if in silent approval. The reason you can have jokes about white people is because there are enough positive portrayals of whites around that those jokes don't become representative of them. But when any group is underrepresented or misrepresented, then any further negative representation is just piling on. Tell Altschluer to put some decent Asian roles onscreen first. Then he can make fun of us all he wants.

There are millions of North American-born Asians, yet you never see them onscreen except as stereotypes or the briefest roles. We've seen blacks win Best Acting Oscars, but I despair that I will ever see an Asian win in my lifetime for playing a regular guy like me -- not because there aren't talented Asian actors but because there are no parts for them except for Harold and Kumar.

Writers are always told to avoid clichés. There is nothing more cliché than a cast of white men and few token women and minorities thrown in as an afterthought.
Scott at 2011-08-27 14:07:24:
@David: Thanks for that response. You hit on what I convey to my students all the time: Create, develop, and incorporate compelling, distinctive and interesting types of characters -- gender, race, religious background, sexual identity. In fact, beyond the mere value of making a story more interesting, it's just smart because 65% of Hollywood movie revenues are generated internationally nowadays. As I noted in a previous post, I don't think it's a coincidence Christopher Nolan chose to flesh out his cast of characters in Inception with people from the U.S., the U.K. (Europe), Asia, and the Middle East.
Sojourner at 2011-08-27 14:53:31:
But above all, write the best story. Even if the main character tells a racist joke. If teaching him racial sensitivity would detract from the best version of the story and it's omitted for that reason, we can all thank the writer for treating us like grownups.
David Eng at 2011-08-27 15:33:40:
You're welcome, Scott. That's an important lesson that not enough people teach.

@Sojourner, you imply that Towne is faultless and that my one complaint means that either I (and other Asians) am not part of "us" or that we are not grownups. I obviously can't speak for you, but I remember when I became a grownup I became less racist, not more. But hey, maybe that's just me.